View Full Version : Germany 2009 - Photos
Lovin' the extreme vein-age on Chris' arm in that second shot down.
I can't decide either it looks scary or sexy! Something in between.
Madtwins
12-12-2009, 07:39 AM
http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/6256/img1134s.jpg
I wonder how I still remember which ones haven't been edited yet! :wacko:
This one is very good!
Madtwins
12-12-2009, 08:01 AM
arguments?
I'm just curious how many photographers sell their work if it's that strict and "illegal". I mean, what's the use for these photos If I can't even have 15 bucks for selling few prints? there were no contracts signed and I offered the band evertthing I've done, and management isn't interested\don't need it or what else. Of course it's cool to have few thousands of photos lying on my hard drive and I appreciate that I was able to take all these shots but I really don't get HOW it may affect band's profit. If they wanted to do something with my photos then I would give it all to them, but I suppose it's understandable that I want these photos to be used and needed. Even if we're talking about 20 people who theoretically may buy prints.
Also Nicole - you said "be very careful about selling high res images of bands for your own personal gain" - I am NOT selling HQ photos, I'm selling prints. There's difference because when you sell print you still own a photo and rights on it are still yours. That's why on Getty Images it cost people 600$ to buy a photo (because they buy all rights on it), and when someone buys a print they only pay for printing, shipping and few bucks to photographer for his/her job.
Enough said, I've dropped an email to management so soon we will find out who was right.
You didn't understood. We mean that logos and band name is defenetly their property. Sure band have some documentery low protected rights on them.
You didn't understood. We mean that logos and band name is defenetly their property. Sure band have some documentery low protected rights on them.
nah I don't need it that much, and Nicole was talking about photos, not name and logos. Do you agree that there's nothing wrong with selling photos, MY property?
thelivingvines
12-12-2009, 07:34 PM
You own the copyright in the photos. It's completely up to you what you do with them. When you start to put logos and things on photos, that's when you start getting into trouble. I'm not sure what the position would be if the photos included clear images of the band logo on the drums... but I very much doubt that would change things.
But, as a friend of the band and as someone who wants to photograph them professionally in the future, your moral obligations may be different.
I'm not sure what the position would be if the photos included clear images of the band logo on the drums... but I very much doubt that would change things.
...also photos include Marshall, Wizard, Gretsch and others logos but I didn't put it there specially. And I don't think I have to blur or remove it all from photographs.
carrymehomestead
12-13-2009, 08:19 AM
People sell photos of musicians/actors/celebrities all the time without an issue...how do you think papparazzi make a living?? Their image is not copyrighted...now, if the band was selling a poster or something image based, and you took a photo of it and made a lower-res version and tried to hawk it at a cheaper price that'd be different...but there's no conflict here. As for the logos, that's also being overthought and worried about...when Rolling Stone publishes a picture of AC/DC playing live, they don't pay Marshall...if anything, it's a free promo for them. And why would people want to buy the pictures if they WEREN'T of The Living End?? It's not like without a shot of the kick drum, they wouldn't realize who it was. The band's name on a kick drum is not what a trademark refers to.
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 02:42 PM
when Rolling Stone publishes a picture of AC/DC playing live, they don't pay Marshall...
thats because AC/DC use Wizard amps ;) who do you think got Cheney onto them?
but yea, what you said is right. it shouldnt be a problem Yana, i was just talking about using the Logo when i brought this up ages ago. ;) they are your photos, your free to do what you will :)
carrymehomestead
12-13-2009, 03:39 PM
thats because AC/DC use Wizard amps
Doh!! *Smacks hand to forehead* Totally knew that, too. For some reason I was thinking of AC/DC as one of the original promoters of the wall of marshall stacks thing people always associate with classic rock. Did they ever use Marshalls?
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 04:17 PM
haha dont worry, 9 out of 10 die hard AC/DC fans dont even know what a Wizard is, and then theres the ones who thought that Malcolms guitar of choice was a les paul :unsure:
ok, this is my understanding, which is probably flawed.
but as far as i know, Wizard amps are all made by hand by one guy named Rick, in canda. AC/DC used marshall all through the early years, but they were pretty unreliable. rick was their amp tec and started repairing/rebuiling them. im not sure if he was AC/DC's tec first, then that evolved into wizard amps, or whether rick already was building wizard amps. but since the early 80's, AC/DC have played through wizard amps. even if the logo says Marshall, the guts of the amp is a wizard.
whats a really quick and flawed explination, but the jist of if it is there. maybe Mick or another muso can confirm/correct me on that.
http://www.chrischeneygear.com/amps.html theres a bit of it on micks site.
when TLE were touring with AC/DC in '01, chris's amp died, and rick let Chris play through Malcolms rig, and yea, chris was playing wizards ever since then.
The Dying Start
12-13-2009, 04:23 PM
haha dont worry, 9 out of 10 die hard AC/DC fans dont even know what a Wizard is...
Harry Potter?
Kacky
12-13-2009, 04:24 PM
Oh Glenn...horrible. Fail for you. :)
The Dying Start
12-13-2009, 04:26 PM
Wingardium Leviosa.
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 07:38 PM
People sell photos of musicians/actors/celebrities all the time without an issue...how do you think papparazzi make a living?? Their image is not copyrighted...now.
The band's name on a kick drum is not what a trademark refers to.
Their image is copyrighted as soon as it is created. There are no legal formalities required to obtain copyright in something. In spite of common belief, you don't even have to include the © symbol and the year. Copyright exists on fixation/crystalisation. Papparazzi's images are of course copyrighted- it is the copyright from which they make their income, they sell a license to publish the photo or the actual copyright in that image.
Trademark is intended as a symbol of origin, and a symbol of quality for the goods/services provided, and it is a useful marketing tool. Supposing TLE is a registered trademark, any use of that trademark which can lead to consumer confusion as to origin (and this is a layman's explanation) may arguably be trademark infringement. If TLE is not a registered trademark, the action of passing off is available where an individual would be trying to make the consumer think that the goods for sale are linked to the TLE name.
As I said in my original post, I doubt there would be a problem- it all depends on how Amur markets her photos. The more compelling argument for Amur is the moral position.
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 07:41 PM
Harry Potter?
outstanding.
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 08:22 PM
whats the moral downside to this? i mean if she starts claiming that they are official photos - fair enough, but i konw she wouldnt do that.
if she just markets them as photos of the band TLE, taken by Yana, at this place, i cant really see a moral issue... or am i overlooking something? she contacted TLE HQ and they didnt want the photos, so its not like she hasnt tried.
id say go for it :) put me down for a tenny one :)
Colezy
12-13-2009, 08:29 PM
arguments?
I'm just curious how many photographers sell their work if it's that strict and "illegal". I mean, what's the use for these photos If I can't even have 15 bucks for selling few prints? there were no contracts signed and I offered the band evertthing I've done, and management isn't interested\don't need it or what else. Of course it's cool to have few thousands of photos lying on my hard drive and I appreciate that I was able to take all these shots but I really don't get HOW it may affect band's profit. If they wanted to do something with my photos then I would give it all to them, but I suppose it's understandable that I want these photos to be used and needed. Even if we're talking about 20 people who theoretically may buy prints.
Also Nicole - you said "be very careful about selling high res images of bands for your own personal gain" - I am NOT selling HQ photos, I'm selling prints. There's difference because when you sell print you still own a photo and rights on it are still yours. That's why on Getty Images it cost people 600$ to buy a photo (because they buy all rights on it), and when someone buys a print they only pay for printing, shipping and few bucks to photographer for his/her job.
Enough said, I've dropped an email to management so soon we will find out who was right.
I didn't say that it was strict or illegal. I said that some managers and management companies don't take it very well - they're not making a single cent out of what you're doing while using the bands image.
I know that you didn't sign a contract for any of the gigs (lucky!), but sometimes they don't seem to care about that and will go after photographers anyway.
Because your shots are really good ones and they are of a high image quality, I thought I'd mention all of that, just in case.
...also photos include Marshall, Wizard, Gretsch and others logos but I didn't put it there specially. And I don't think I have to blur or remove it all from photographs.
No! Don't blur those logos out - a friend of mine had a close up shot of a certain guitar companies logo/badge thing in their photo and got paid by the company to use his image to promote their gear!
whats the moral downside to this? i mean if she starts claiming that they are official photos - fair enough, but i konw she wouldnt do that.
if she just markets them as photos of the band TLE, taken by Yana, at this place, i cant really see a moral issue... or am i overlooking something? she contacted TLE HQ and they didnt want the photos, so its not like she hasnt tried.
id say go for it :) put me down for a tenny one :)
Yeah I'm editing photos already, and meanwhile waiting for reply from HQ. To make everything absolutely clear.:)
I didn't say that it was strict or illegal. I said that some managers and management companies don't take it very well - they're not making a single cent out of what you're doing while using the bands image.
I know that you didn't sign a contract for any of the gigs (lucky!), but sometimes they don't seem to care about that and will go after photographers anyway.
Because your shots are really good ones and they are of a high image quality, I thought I'd mention all of that, just in case.
No! Don't blur those logos out - a friend of mine had a close up shot of a certain guitar companies logo/badge thing in their photo and got paid by the company to use his image to promote their gear!
Thanks for warnings then, I hope no one's feelings will get hurt in the end! ;)
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 08:32 PM
looking forward to it :) i think ill take a Tenny one, and a Phoenix one and a POW one :)
in that order (because im too poor to buy 3 at once). yep. thats my plan.
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 08:35 PM
I may have missed something, but I thought she said they hadn't responded directly saying yes or no.
If they did say it was fine and she were to (and I'm sure she wouldn't) say that the band had endorsed her as a photographer or something- that might cause problems.
The only moral issue is whether she sees it as a problem that she is making money from a photoshoot they did for her as a sort of favour not knowing that she might intend to sell the pictures. As for the live pictures, if she's offered them to the band and they've said they don't need pictures at the mo or whatever, then I guess there isn't much of a moral argument. Other than not wanting to be lumped in with the likes of Corporate machines like Getty, and remaining an ally of the band. I would just be concerned that she has fostered a relationship with the band, and it might be dented somewhat if it looked like she had forged it for financial gain. It's a very cynical interpretation, but it's a conclusion that someone might draw.
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 08:37 PM
No! Don't blur those logos out - a friend of mine had a close up shot of a certain guitar companies logo/badge thing in their photo and got paid by the company to use his image to promote their gear!
Amur, please tell me you already went to Gretsch with these? they'll love your work.
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 08:40 PM
i suggested that aaages ago.
how are these not the best Gretsch photos you have ever seen!
usually photos of Gretsch guitars look akward, dull, and plain, and just bad. its really hard to get the beauty of these guitars in phots, and your one of the only - if not the only - person to show how good these guitars really look.
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 08:42 PM
Compared with the photos they had for the promotion of his custom, you mean? They were appalling.
Chris is such an ambassador for Gretsch, it's a shame it isn't used to the advantage of the company outside australia. It would do the band a lot of good too I am sure. Having Amur's photos can only help, right?
The only moral issue is whether she sees it as a problem that she is making money from a photoshoot they did for her as a sort of favour not knowing that she might intend to sell the pictures.
I never intended to sell this photoshoot so there's no problem with that.
And no, I haven't contacted Gretsch people yet - I don't really know the way how they can use these photos, but I'll give it a try soon!
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 08:47 PM
i mean look at this!
this guitar costs close enough to $8000
and look at what Gretsch are currently using to advertise it!
http://gretschguitars.com/images/setzer_phoenix.jpg
that picture was taken from the gretsch website, on the Black Phoenix's page.
compare that to Yana's work.
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/2212/img9633ss.jpg
what one is better?
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 08:52 PM
on the cheney models page.
http://gretsch.com.au/featured/chrischeney/images/cheney_4.jpg
thats what Gretsch are using.
this is what they could be using:
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/7784/img1345s.jpg
Colezy
12-13-2009, 08:53 PM
I know the girl who took the ones on the site :p
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 08:53 PM
some old bloke covered in tats and a load of glare
vs
well... yes.
I guess Gretsch would say that more people know who Brian Setzer is than Chris Cheney, and therefore provides better marketability.
thelivingvines
12-13-2009, 08:54 PM
I know the girl who took the ones on the site :p
slap her with a fish next time you see her.
Mitch-PTV
12-13-2009, 08:58 PM
some old bloke covered in tats and a load of glare
vs
well... yes.
I guess Gretsch would say that more people know who Brian Setzer is than Chris Cheney, and therefore provides better marketability.
i know that brian setzer should be shown playing his signature guitar, but that was just an example. who knows, you get in with Gretsch, im sure they would use your talents to get some better pictures up, even if that means organizing a little something with mr setzer :p
some old bloke covered in tats and a load of glare
vs
well... yes.
I guess Gretsch would say that more people know who Brian Setzer is than Chris Cheney, and therefore provides better marketability.
Yeah of course photo of Setzer makes more sense to many guitar players than Chris', but photos of Cheney sig model would be useful for something.
Mitch-PTV
12-14-2009, 06:21 AM
i say you find your BEST few cheney sig shots, contact Gretsch Australia (www.gretsch.com.au) and see what they say.
contacting Gretsch USA would probably be a waste (at the moment) because they dont advertise the Cheney model, but who knows what can happen down the line. id mention that you have photos of him playing a Brian Setzer Black Phoenix and a Power Tenny, as well as a couple of White Falcons. also mention that you'd be interested in expanding and taking photos of other Gretsch players maybe?
you easilly have the best Gretsch photos out there, any muso here can back that up. you should go for it :)
i say you find your BEST few cheney sig shots, contact Gretsch Australia (www.gretsch.com.au) and see what they say.
contacting Gretsch USA would probably be a waste (at the moment) because they dont advertise the Cheney model, but who knows what can happen down the line. id mention that you have photos of him playing a Brian Setzer Black Phoenix and a Power Tenny, as well as a couple of White Falcons. also mention that you'd be interested in expanding and taking photos of other Gretsch players maybe?
you easilly have the best Gretsch photos out there, any muso here can back that up. you should go for it :)
thank you for compliments!
actually, "expanding and taking photos of other Gretsch players" sounds impossible to me at this stage, considering I haven't ever seen Gretsch players in my city. I guess there are some, but they are surely not popular enough to become interesting for Gretsch employees. to take photos of other musicians I need to travel to other countries which takes a lot of money. :mellow:
I've looked at website already, thinking about writing to them tomarrow.
All_torn_down16
12-14-2009, 09:25 AM
I’d just like to add that I would definitely buy at least one poster if you can start selling them Yana :).
you easilly have the best Gretsch photos out there, any muso here can back that up. you should go for it :)
I definitely agree with this too.
Ben reed
12-14-2009, 09:42 AM
Yeah i agree with mitch, the photos of the gretsches look amazing!
Mitch-PTV
12-14-2009, 03:03 PM
thank you for compliments!
actually, "expanding and taking photos of other Gretsch players" sounds impossible to me at this stage, considering I haven't ever seen Gretsch players in my city. I guess there are some, but they are surely not popular enough to become interesting for Gretsch employees. to take photos of other musicians I need to travel to other countries which takes a lot of money. :mellow:
I've looked at website already, thinking about writing to them tomarrow.
ah i didnt even think about that, despite how obvious it was *facepalm* if theres bands that use them, just take photos that really bring out the guitar nicely, and send them off too, just to show that you can really capture these guitars.
the Brian Setzer orchestra are touring, you wouldnt get a chance to see them in russia would you? i mean, i know the concert would cost a bit, but you would get to see a great act and get some kick ass gretsch photos with setzer ;)
ah i didnt even think about that, despite how obvious it was *facepalm* if theres bands that use them, just take photos that really bring out the guitar nicely, and send them off too, just to show that you can really capture these guitars.
the Brian Setzer orchestra are touring, you wouldnt get a chance to see them in russia would you? i mean, i know the concert would cost a bit, but you would get to see a great act and get some kick ass gretsch photos with setzer ;)
I would love to see Setzer Big Band, but they don't come over here, unfortunately. :ermm: I would buy a ticket if it was in Russia but I can't travel anywhere to see the concert in other country.
I've benn told that I have to wait til Rae returns from holidays in the beginning of january to receive her answer on prints, until then destiny of these concert photos is undecided.
Anyhow, I edited and re-edited (sorry, love to make things better!) couple of shots.
http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1748/img22392s.jpg
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/6337/img2400s.jpg
http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/7214/img2234s.jpg
http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/7608/img2211e.jpg
http://img706.imageshack.us/img706/2972/img2248s.jpg
http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/3081/img2822s.jpg
http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/3891/img2284sg.jpg
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/4371/img23911s.jpg
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/5275/img23121s.jpg
Jenana
12-19-2009, 11:15 AM
Wow! Awesome shots! You're a spectacular photographer. I'd definitely buy a poster if you decided to sell.
Thanks for showing them.
Wow! Awesome shots! You're a spectacular photographer. I'd definitely buy a poster if you decided to sell.
Thanks for showing them.
thank you :happy:
hopefully I will start selling them in new year, just need to get reply from management first.
Mitch-PTV
12-19-2009, 06:16 PM
looking great as usual, BUT in the second photo on the previous page, too much blue! its called a white falcon for a reason :p hehe im sure 90% of people dont care, and the rest think it looks great, but still, a white falcon is a white falcon ;) yeeea, im just looking for stuff to criticise now
Mitch-PTV
12-19-2009, 06:17 PM
also, im stealing the first picture on this page :)
Ben reed
12-19-2009, 06:32 PM
Mitch i'd love to see a falcon that blue colour and maybe with swirls of white.
AND SILVER BINDING:woot:!!
Mitch-PTV
12-19-2009, 06:37 PM
ive seen a penguin like that but with pink instead of blue... didnt do it for me.
but in saying that, were comparing a pink penguin to a blue falcon... hmmm...
looking great as usual, BUT in the second photo on the previous page, too much blue! its called a white falcon for a reason :p hehe im sure 90% of people dont care, and the rest think it looks great, but still, a white falcon is a white falcon ;) yeeea, im just looking for stuff to criticise now
usually concert lights have different colors that's why Chris has purple face and blue falcon. sorry, couldn't fix white balance any further :flowers: and I don't like turning many photos into B/W when it's unnecessary
The Dying Start
12-19-2009, 06:38 PM
Hahaha. Ben = 1; Mitch = Embarrassed.
Ben reed
12-19-2009, 06:46 PM
ive seen a penguin like that but with pink instead of blue... didnt do it for me.
but in saying that, were comparing a pink penguin to a blue falcon... hmmm...
Yeah i saw that guitar in a magazine but i thought it looked amazing!
Mitch-PTV
12-19-2009, 07:29 PM
i just like my falcons white, maybe a nice aged cream colour like chris's POW falcon.
sually concert lights have different colors that's why Chris has purple face and blue falcon. sorry, couldn't fix white balance any further and I don't like turning many photos into B/W when it's unnecessary
haha i was just trying to be overly picky, the photo looks great ;)
AlinaPOW
12-19-2009, 09:43 PM
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/4371/img23911s.jpg
woah! I hope you get big and famous someday soon!
Colezy
12-19-2009, 10:08 PM
Mmmm, I love that one too, Alina! :wub:
TaylorLovesChrisCheneyx
12-19-2009, 11:56 PM
woah......Taylor likes! :happy:
thanks girls, but I suppose you wouldn't think this photo looks so cool if you saw some alien bit of fluff hanging on Chris' sidewhiskers, it's not obvious when you look at small version of the photo :laugh:
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